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Ep. 62 – Magdalena Rungaldier – Freedom + Sustainability

Mich Bondesio chats to Magdalena Rungaldier of MAp Consultancy about building a B Corp business based on freedom, creating sustainable hotels, setting productivity boundaries, and finding enjoyment from your work.

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Magdalena Rungaldier, Principal of Map Boutique Consultancy

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Creating Cadence Podcast Transcript – Episode 62

Published 22nd May 2024

Mich Bondesio:

Hi, and welcome to Creating Cadence, a podcast for life and work in motion. I’m your host Mich Bondesio, a writer, speaker, coach, and solo entrepreneur. I’m also the author of The Cadence Effect. I help high achievers stuck on the toxic treadmill of overwork to transform your approach to life, work, and business.

So we can all activate more of our potential, improve our wellbeing and performance, and find joy in every part of our life. At a cadence that’s more suitable to us. Despite this fast paced world we live in.

This is episode 62, the second of season 10, published in late May, 2024.

In today’s interview, I’m chatting with Magdalena Rungaldier, a marketer, brand strategist, and B corporate business owner.

Her business is called MAp Boutique Consultancy, and her clients are innovative, sustainable, and successful hotels, which she and her team support with marketing, branding, and positioning services.

It’s a fantastic conversation about aligning business and personal values; rules and rituals for productivity; and why Magdalena chose to go the B Corp route.

But first, a quick news Roundup.

We’re almost at the end of the Cadence Coaching Programme with just a few weeks still to go. I’ve been working with lovely people and have also learned so much myself from the process.

Secondly, I mentioned on the last episode that my book, The Cadence Effect, is celebrating its first anniversary this month. I have two special offers for the book running for the full month of May, if you buy direct from my Shopify store, which you can access via my website,

The first offer is 24% of the cost of the PRINT BOOK with coupon code MAY24-PRINT24. This excludes shipping. The print edition includes the workbook exercises built into the book.

For the second offer, if you buy the E-BOOK, you get the PDF workbook for free, which is valued at £7.99, if you use coupon code MAY24-EBOOKDEAL. The e-book doesn’t have the workbook exercises like the print book does, but you can get the separate workbook for free when you use the special coupon code when you buy the ebook.

I’ll share those links and codes to both of those in the show notes, the offers expire at midnight UK time on the 31st of May, 2024.

The third bit of news is quite exciting in that I’ve got a new product in the pipeline. I’ve been approached about running an adventure version of the Cadence Coaching Programme as a team building offsite.

This sparked the idea to perhaps put together my own retreats and offsite packages for entrepreneurs and corporate teams. So I’m currently doing some research on suitable locations and potential activities to include. They will include focused facilitated sessions around common, intentional productivity challenges, alongside fun activities that also challenge us positively. If this is something that you or your company or organisation might be interested in, then please get in touch.

You can email me at hello @

So onto the interview segment of the podcast.

Magdalena Rungaldier is the principle of MAp Boutique Consultancy. Her business focus is on making innovative, sustainable and successful hotels, through marketing, branding and positioning. MAp is a B Corp certified boutique consultancy that is shaping the future of the hospitality industry through innovative and sustainable hotels.

Magdalena’s company MAP empowers independent and boutique hoteliers hospitality brands, and investors on their journeys to creating hotels that make a positive impact and stand out on the map. The sustainable hotel is their hotel sustainability platform. To make hotels thrive in a way that’s not only good for business, but good for people and the planet too.

Now Magdalena hails from Italy, but her office is based in Switzerland, and she also works remotely depending on her travels, as her clients are based throughout Europe and also the world. As you will hear, Magdalena is an exceptionally savvy and pragmatic business woman who also knows how to have fun in her business.

She shares several thought-provoking insights about more nurturing ways that we can work. From being more intentional about enjoying your work and designing a work culture that creates safety for your team. To setting strong boundaries with clients around communication styles. And creating rituals that support wellbeing and productivity, no matter where you are. We also talk about the role of self-belief and activating goals and the benefits of joining the B Corp movement.

I always come away from conversations with Magdalena feeling inspired, and I’m sure you will too. Don’t forget to stick around at the very end, as I highlight a few points that came up in the conversation. And why I think they’re important.

So if you’re ready, let’s dive in.

So welcome to the podcast, Magdalena. I’m excited to have you on the show.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:04:49] Hello, Mich. I’m super happy to be with you and to talk about creating cadence.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:04:55] Oh, fantastic.

So Magdalena, before we get started, some background for the audience. We first met through a mutual friend Veronica Fossa, when she set up a mastermind group several years ago, and when the official group disbanded, we’ve subsequently continued to meet up online almost every month since then.

And the purpose of those meetups is to kind of act as a sounding board and to provide peer support for each other in our businesses, even though what you do is very different to what I do. And we will get into that during our conversation. But what I really appreciate in those opportunities to meet with you is that you always have such excellent and unique business insights, many of which have guided me in how I’ve developed my business over the last few years.

So I just wanted to say, I’m incredibly grateful to be able to have access to your expertise and experience in that way. Thank you.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:05:43] Oh, that’s so sweet. Thank you, Mich. Uh, yeah, but also for me, our meetings, our exchange of ideas, they’re super valuable.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:05:52] I agree. Thank you. So I’m also curious about the journey that you’re on with B Corp and the work that you’re doing to create sustainable hotels, because my path is also leading me to want to work more with B Corp businesses. But we’ll talk about that a little bit later on in the conversation. First of all, I want to start with you.

You’ve been working in the sector of tourism and hospitality since 2004, and you have heaps of experience in strategic marketing and brand development, both in your existing company and also in various roles prior to that. But tell us more about where you are in this moment. What’s your current life and work context?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:06:26] Ah, yes, you’re right. I mean, I’m South Tyrolean. That’s, northern, the northernmost region of Italy. Many will know it maybe because of the Dolomites and it’s a very touristy region. So already when I grew up tourism was always like, yeah, the ‘go to’ industry for me. And I felt it was so super exciting, because it’s not just one subject you have to know when you go into tourism.

Also a hotel, so many people meet there, employees, the guests, the partners and so on. And that still reflects where I am right now with my business, with MAp boutique consultancy, because we are working mostly in the hospitality industry. We have also other clients we are working for. And we are supporting them in the fields of positioning, branding, and marketing.

And that’s, wide fields. So that meanswe can do strategic marketing, but then we can support with social media strategies. Then we are coaching on sustainability. We are right now launching a new hotel. And, I guess that’s what always has driven me that I love to do various things and to have some kind of, yeah, that I’m not falling into some kind of rut.

And I guess also my team likes that very much, even if it’s very challenging sometimes. Because you’re not a specialist. Sometimes you are a generalist. And that’s where you have to, yeah, have to juggle different balls. Let’s call it like this.

Yeah, but that’s now since 10 years Map Boutique Consultancy is in the market working with hotels.

Also that working with hotels all over the globe, which is also interesting because it keeps you very much open minded. But on the other hand, of course, it’s also exciting because you have to do with a lot of destination markets, people, cultures, and so on. And as you mentioned, that’s also since the pandemic, since 2020, sustainability was not only something we talked about or what we included in our work, but what became part of our purpose or of our core and therefore we also built our platform, the Sustainable Hotel, to support all kind of hoteliers and business owners to make their businesses and hotels more sustainable. And, in the same time as well more successful.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:08:51] That’s fantastic. And I, I love that for several reasons, because it’s about putting purpose and the planet alongside profit. It’s as important. But also, my listeners may not know that Prior to becoming a coach and a consultant with my business brand Cadence, I actually worked in destination management for seven years, organizing conferences and incentives at hotels.

And then, as part of that experience, I was asked to head their corporate social responsibility division and organize. sustainable types of activities for the groups that were visiting. So I know a little bit about the importance of this and I’m so interested and excited by what you’re doing because it’s very much in line with what I believe in as well in terms of saving the planet, should I say.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:09:38] Yeah. Oh, that’s exciting. That’s seven years. That’s a long time, Mich, to been being in that.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:09:43] It is a long time.

All right. So let’s explore a little bit more about the impact of your current situation on your wellbeing, creativity, and productivity. What are the benefits of the way that you work and the sector that you work in? And what are the challenges that you experienced in your particular situation?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:09:59] Oh, the benefits, and this now may sound very cheesy, is that I can do what I love to do and what I want to do. Let’s put it like this. That’s my business. And four years ago or five years ago now, nearly, I decided I want to have my own sustainability platform. We are going to write seven handbooks. And yes, I can even run my own shop.

That was, everybody was saying, but this sounds like a very strange idea. Did you calculate it? And, I was like, I can do it. So I can create my own business. I can create my own lifestyle and so on. Now, what I have to say that that’s also very much adjusted to my personality.

I love to travel. I have to move around. So this is something I also have to say that many people, when looking at my life, they will feel like, “Oh, this is not my kind of life. I don’t see any benefit in there”, but for me, that works perfectly well. And, I just pointed out several times was that I can do what I want.

And that’s also something, because I have to say that, I truly loved your book, Mich, Yeah. And there’s so many recommendations and insights in there. And, uh, we will touch, I guess, upon some of those points, but one thing that you mentioned was this procrastination, and you have so many good insights on that.

And I always feel that what helps me is to be very clear that I am not forced to do many things. So often we feel like, “Oh, I have to do this now”. And when I reflect on that, I always say, no, this is my choice. There are really only a few things in my life that I really have to do. And therefore this is the life I’ve built.

It’s not that I, every day I love every single task, but that’s also not important, but that’s something where you, what you’ve asked. Yes. I’ve built a business and the life that I love.

The challenges of course, once you have a team, once you have many clients, once you’re working with clients all over the world, yeah. It’s interesting, they’re all people, it’s everybody has needs, wants, desires, I don’t know what, and so you have to organize that, you never have to forget it. That that’s all people, not businesses, and they have all their different lives, their problems, their challenges, and so you can do, whatever you can do in that moment, you try to, you do to do your best.

So that are all challenges. And, especially in hospitality, where it’s a people business. So we are not only having the challenge with, the guests, but then you have the employees, then you have the partners who are not delivering and so on. So of course, to bring all these parts together, sometimes might be a challenge also in creating cadence, let’s put it like this.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:12:56] Fair enough. I think that’s a really good and important point that you’ve raised around the fact that people bring their stuff with them to work. That’s what you’re dealing with. It’s not just about the service or the client, or the task at hand in terms of the branding or the marketing, it’s all the other emotions and the baggage that comes with it, that, that you’re juggling as well.

Especially because your team is quite small and you’re working with clients all over the place around the world. And, it’s a lot to manage and I commend you on managing it the way that you do with a small team. And, that’s one of the things I love about you, Magdalena, you have such a can do attitude.

You’re incredibly positive about lots of things. Even when you’re facing challenges. You always know that there’s a way through and you know that you can figure it out. And that’s very empowering for people to know. You know, often we become paralysed by things like procrastination or we may feel like because we don’t know the answer that we’re going to fail.

But, you know that you have the ability to figure it out. And that type of mindset can completely change the trajectory of your business. So thank you for raising that.

So, I know that you travel a lot for work and also for fun and travel can impact on our daily routines. So what are your regular habits and routines that you have in place to support your well being and creativity and productivity?

And how do you adapt them when you’re traveling, both maybe for you and for your team, if that applies?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:14:23] Mm, yes, and there are maybe some general rules. I know that if I don’t follow them, it will, it will hit me hard. Let’s put it like this. The first thing is being organised. This may sound very stupid, but for me, it’s essential. and we are recording this on a Friday afternoon, I’ve spent this Friday afternoon to plan out next week.

I cannot even go into the weekend if I don’t know what’s happening next week.

Early morning, every team member already knows in their calendars what they’re going to do, and we start off the week running. But this being organised is super important for me, because if not, I’m not able to think or do anything.

The second part is something I’ve learned recently more, is looking after my body. And what I eat when I travel a lot or when I’m at trade fairs or events, I realise if I’m eating out a lot, or eating always heavy, or in restaurants, this is killing me, my whole system. And this is super strange also when I realized it, because I never thought about that. I know you have it as well in the book, that this is impacting so much your productivity and well being. But that’s something for traveling that is super important. That I see that I get my kind of food, that it’s healthy, that it’s fresh and so on.

And also looking after my mental health.

So that will always find a place that I do some kind of meditation, time off. I’m a big fan, spending time off technology. I do my Kriya. That’s something I need, this kind of balancing, grounding, and so on. So these are basics, and if I don’t get them right, everything else is like a mess.


Mich Bondesio:

[00:16:14] I love those. Those are what I refer to as your foundations and they are super important and they’re the kind of things that if they’ve become a regular practice for you, you can implement them irrespective of where you are, you know, they’re elastic practices. So like the meditation, depending on how much time you have or where you are, those are things that you can adapt to the environment that you’re in.

And, the food thing is incredibly important. I agree. When I am going through a particularly stressful period, I know I have to pay more attention to my nutrition, because if I don’t, it creates a vicious cycle in terms of my mood and everything being affected. So really good points you’ve raised there.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:16:57] Thank you. Um, anything on the productivity front with you and your team in terms of where you work and how you work.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:17:00] Exactly, so for for me, technology, and also here, I have to refer back to you as well, to your book. I mean, you write about technology and how helpful it is, but how harmful. And for me, technology nowadays, it’s a killer. So this is something I’m very clear also with my team. I also, when we are working together, I don’t want to see any mobile phones.

I don’t want them on to be on loud. I don’t want to have all these things and whatever, because it’s just a distraction. And so with technology use, we are using a lot of technology. We are using a lot of digital tools. They support our processes and workflows. They are super important and so helpful that we have as a small team access to this kind of tools nowadays. That’s like incredible.

On the other hand, I feel like Emails, Slack, Whatsapp messages, now clients are sending Whatsapp messages. And for me, it’s very clear, I’m checking my emails twice a day, I’m checking my Whatsapp once a day, and 90 percent of the time, I’m not answering calls. So sometimes I feel even clients are shocked when I answer and they are like, “Oh, you are near your phone”.

And I’m like, “yeah, today I responded”. I will call back. I will answer their emails. But to me, when I look at how people are interacting, especially with social media, this is like crazy. So, we use the technology we need, but all of this notifications, we avoid it as much as possible. And, if a team member says, and I always encourage them, Hey, if you are working on an important task, just block yourself off, just tell us this morning for the whole morning you are working on that.

And that’s totally okay. And by the way, just to mention that as well, every team member is totally, totally flexible in their working hours. So, we have to align on some joint working hours, but if not, they can decide when they want to work. And if they don’t feel well, and if they would like to do a walk and come afterwards, they can do so.

So that’s super important for me. And I also don’t want that they work late in the evening or on weekends. No email is going out from our team on weekends, because I don’t think that’s sustainable and it should not be normalised that on Sunday you are doing working emails. So all of this technology is very much used, but also very much restricted.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:19:28] I think that’s fantastic that you set those very firm boundaries. You’re setting the example not just for how you work as a team, but also to your clientele. How do they respond to that? When you say, these are our terms. We’re not contactable on the weekend. We don’t reply to emails.

Has it, has there been any backlash on that or have they been able to adapt to that quite easily?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:19:47] Oh, and that’s maybe interesting, a hotel is always open. So for them, every day is a working day. And that’s okay. There might be situations where I understand that for a launch the weekend before, we are also available. But if not, I’m always saying you have to set your boundaries and I’m not responding on emails on weekends.

And so far, no clients asked me, but why aren’t you checking your emails on Sunday, because in that moment, I mean, I tell them because it’s Sunday. That’s okay, isn’t it? And no, that’s no problem, because I feel we are very much organised the rest of the week. So if they send an email, as mentioned, we are not answering right now, but they will get an email straight ahead.

And that’s something I also, I mean, purpose is important, but so many times nowadays I hear this, Oh my gosh, I have to find my search for meaning, find my self worth, and so on. And everybody’s so super important and what they’re doing. And to me also, when we talking about the team and I realise my colleagues are getting nervous about a project or so, I often tell them, “Hey, we are just doing marketing. We are not now doing an open heart surgery.

You know, just stay a bit humble. And why should the world not spin anymore if I’m not answering an email on Sunday, you know. Also that’s sometimes when I talk, especially to new business owners or so I often feel like, “Hey, trying to run a small business, do your best, but keep your perspective straight.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:21:32] Absolutely.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:21:33] And this also helps the mental health of my team. I see that afterwards they’re like, yeah, it’s true. No one will be killed by this or that. And I’m not saying that lightly. You have to be very meticulous about your work, take on the responsibility., Oh, also, also what we, I think we discussed that once, all this shouting on LinkedIn and how good everybody is, how many awards they win, their client, win awards.

And I’m like, gosh, this, this doesn’t make me any better or whatever. So also this I’ve always feel is so important. Just keep your perspective..

Mich Bondesio:

[00:22:10] Keep your perspective and be humble. As you’ve said, I like that a lot. I actually write in the book also about setting those boundaries up front when you’re starting with new clients around how you respond and don’t, you know, you’re going to deliver the work, but it’ll be in the time that works for you.

And that’s all about collaborating and co-creating with your clients rather than working for them. You know, there’s a difference there.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:22:32] Yeah, and also, we doing mostly strategic work. Yes, we are creating brands and website, but if not, we are strategic consultants and there would be many things that we do wrong. If we need to answer in two hours, you know, that’s like…

Mich Bondesio:

[00:22:51] Yeah, you don’t want to make the mistakes. You want to make the right decisions.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:22:54] Yeah. And here, what you just said. You have to be very clear about this is how we are working. And I often explain as well why. Why I’m not answering a phone call, because I’m telling when I’m working on your strategy, you might be also happy if I’m not taking five calls and miss out on important parts.

And then everybody’s saying like, yeah, that’s true. Or when I’m in a, in a workshop with your team, you would be also happy if I’m not answering calls from anybody else, and so, you know, It’s just sometimes to put it in perspective.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:23:26] Correct. All right. So let’s talk a bit more about cadence. What does that concept of cadence mean for you? How does the idea of creating cadence resonate for you personally?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:23:38] Oh, it resonates so much. And I mean, that was not just a compliment as a compliment, but I truly meant it that your book had so many great insights in there and so many inputs on how to create cadence and why it is so important. And I feel that’s for me always a learning experience. So it’s a process.

And over the last 10 years, what I’ve realised that for me, the most important thing is, or what I’m personally always struggling with is that I don’t have enough time. I always feel I don’t have enough time. Uh, that’s s like my situation where I have to create this cadence and it’s always a learning process where there are a lot of, um, moments where I realised, as I said before, this eating healthy, that was something I understood, wow, this is like a game changer.

Or that moment, I realised how much the space I’m working in is important. So for all future business owners, that would be one of my biggest recommendations, get an office as soon as possible. That changed my whole business, not working anymore from home. But going to a space that is dedicated and set up for work. So, but that are all learnings and steps and so on.


Mich Bondesio:

[00:24:57] That’s a great suggestion. I mean, that’s part of the reason why I co work. Um, I have an, a home office for certain types of work, but I definitely need that interaction and that other space. And I think that you know, especially as creative people, the work that you do is creative in nature.

You’re a creative thinker and a strategic thinker. And what I do is also creative. And that really can impact on your level of creativity, is the space that you work in as well. So. I think it’s important you’ve mentioned that.

All right. So how does cadence apply in your actual business in terms of how perhaps you manage the pace of work to support your team and how you also help your clients to move forward and build momentum with their businesses?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:25:36] Yeah. I like what you also, you wrote about seeing it as a bicycle, right? So always keep going. And sometimes you have to pedal a bit harder and sometimes you can slow down, and it’s important that you find that rhythm.

And that’s also important for me. So, and especially talking about team or clients, and talking about hospitality as well, there are high season, low season. We always have to oscillate between that. And it’s very clear that there are some times where we have to pedal much harder, and then now we are entering the summer season. Hopefully all our hotel clients who have high season in summer are fully booked, so we can slow down a bit, go on holidays and so on.

And for me, it’s very important that my team as well understands that. I feel it’s very unhealthy nowadays that a lot of creative agencies, they’re always going full stride. That’s not working as you point out. So for me, this is very important. I also feel that there needs to be always space when a team member doesn’t feel well, has some challenges, and so on, that they can say, “Hey, I know it’s busy, but I’m not able”.

And that’s okay. So I feel what we have lost, over the years is that, uh, giving team members safety. Not only getting them set, you know, with technologies, tools, learnings, but also making them feel safe to say, “Hey, I don’t feel well”. And I’m just not able to perform this week and that should be okay.

So this I feel is very important. And for me, how I visualise it as well is that we are all juggling balls in the air.

I think I told that you once that that story, and it’s also a concept, a strategic concept that we are all juggling balls. And we just have to understand what material these balls are made of.

Because some are made of glass, and if they fall down, they’re gone. And that’s like family, friends, your loved ones. And there are some balls made out of plastic, and so on. And I like that concept very well, that I’m juggling the balls with some kind of rhythm, but I know that some balls, if they fall down, they will never be repaired.

And that’s something that helps me as well to organise my life and to keep that balance and rhythm. And always take care that not what’s not the urgent things always like on top of mind, but also the really important ones for. only that week or month for the client.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:28:23] That’s such a powerful analogy. Thank you for sharing that. Um, as you say, the work that we do, it’s not open heart surgery. It’s not life saving, urgent stuff, in that respect. And to understand that context and that perspective and to always hold in place what’s most important. And, you mentioned about creating the trusted environment for your team to be able to share when they’re experiencing challenges or struggling. And that that’s part of that, you know, you’re holding space for them as well. So, so important.

And it goes back to what you said right at the beginning about you’re dealing with people. We’re dealing with people at the end of the day, they may work in businesses.

You know, there may be a brand that you’re all focused around with a project, but it’s the people behind it that help to create these experiences and, and so on. And so they’re the ones we need to be taking care of. So important.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:29:13] Exactly, yeah.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:29:15] So a little bit more on Cadence and the business front. Part of what you say in your bio is that you’re helping businesses to move beyond profit to purpose and resilience.

And you’ve spoken a little bit about your sustainable hotels brand, but I also want to talk about this concept of B Corp and how this focus on the triple bottom line helps you to be more aligned with your business and life because Cadence is also about alignment. It’s about creating connection between things, so there’s less friction.

So how does that play out and why, you know, what made you decide to go into B Corp and how does that help you kind of align your values with what you do?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:29:50] Yeah, and you mentioned The Sustainable Hotel, this platform, handbooks, and so on, that we’ve created. And, when we started out, it was not that that was like a dream of ours that we are going to write handbooks now. But the hard truth is that, we could not find any practical material on sustainability for independent hotels.

And that’s the niche we are working in. And so we started creating them. And, and on the other hand, we thought, okay, it’s important not only to talk to talk, but to walk the walk. And so we started seeing, okay, what kind of certifications are out there? How can we also, uh, learn more and. be part of a community we believe in, and so we found B Corp.

And for us there are, and I mentioned them already, two parts to it. One’s that sustainability, or running a business, or whatever, it’s always a process. And, what we’ve learned there during the whole process, through the certification, about the triple bottom line, but also other concepts of sustainability, was super insightful. And, also, this was a team effort, and it was great for me to see that if you go through such a process together, everybody feels at one stage, wow, we are part of it. We understand it now. We are, we are working on it. We are creating a sustainability handbook. We are creating this kind and that template and so on.

And that was amazing to see. And I feel that’s still such an important part that not some kind of management, or I, or the principal decided now we are doing that, but we did it together. And that’s sustainability, you know, and that’s empowered everybody in the team.

And the second part is really this, that we are part now of the B Corp community.

So we can reach out to them. There are monthly calls, there are monthly developments, there are monthly challenges, because also here, we should keep the perspective. Um, most of the world economy, and I’m an economist, is not interested in sustainable development. So, but there is this bubble where you can share, where you can see, where you can find solutions.

And I think that’s very important also. And I think also in future and with the rise of technology, communities will be becoming so much more important, and even stronger.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:32:19] That’s really interesting. Thank you. Thanks for talking more about that. B Corp is a growing movement and for my listeners, I will share some links to that in the show notes. Highly recommend looking into that because it’s kind of the future of the way we need to run our businesses. It’s becoming a non negotiable.

All right. So a final question for you, Lena, do you have any words of advice or key takeaways that you want to share with listeners based on your experience of life and work so far?

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:32:47] Mm. Yes, I’ll share that. But I always share as well with my team, don’t take it too serious. Honestly. have one team member who, how can I say that, who always wants to reach the destination? So and say, while she’s working on it, you can see that she’s like struggling, or not that happy, or not that relaxed.

And I tell her always, Hey, if you’re not enjoying the way, because once we are reaching that summit, there will be another project and another task. So really, for me, this understanding to to keep the perspective, not to take everything so serious, but on the other hand, do your work meticulous, step by step, take responsibility for it, get better every day.

If you are not having fun on the way, also when you do small, little, shitty tasks, Then it will be a difficult life and it will be difficult to succeed. That’s like, you have to enjoy, um, also the tasks where you are like, gosh, I need an assistant for it. And I can tell you, once you’re a business owner, you become the assistant of everybody.

You’re doing all the tasks, you know, so that everybody can do their work. So that’s really my biggest advice. We take so many things so seriously. This title, or this project, or this client name is so important. But in the end, from my experience, if you like what you do, if you do it meticulously, when you do it with focus and involvement, when you care more about the people than the numbers, you will sooner or later have success, and in a sustainable way.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:34:35] Mm. I love that. And it’s so true. We spend so much of our times at work, so much of our time and our day at work and in our life. you know, if you’re not having fun, then you’re gonna be a very unhappy camper for most of your days.

Yeah. Great point. Thank you so much, Lena. So before we end off, please tell people where they can find you and MAp online.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:34:57] Yes. Best is to visit our website. It’s And there you find all the links to all the other social media channels. And of course, you can find myself as well on LinkedIn. Happy to connect. And thank you for listening. Thank you for having me, Mich.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:35:18] Thank you so, so much for being on the show, Lena. I’ve absolutely loved this conversation and I know that my listeners will benefit from it too.

Magdalena Rungaldier:

[00:35:24] Thank you, Mich.

Mich Bondesio:

[00:35:26] Well, Magdalena shared many encouraging observations and insights about better ways to work. And I’m so grateful for her willingness to talk so extensively about how these things play out in her own business.

Here’s a few things that stuck out for me in particular.

Magdalena is proud of the fact that her business was designed to support her need for freedom and adventures. And she engages in practices that don’t just support her wellbeing, but also support her to maintain a strong, positive mindset and self-belief, so that she can reach for and attain those long-term visions and big goals.

As a business owner, you have an opportunity to design a business that you love, too. So that you can work in a way that supports you, too, that ties in with your values, too. And this is something that Denver Nowicz also spoke about in the last episode.

And how that translates for Magdalena is that she works in a way that gives her the freedom to work where she wants and wherever she wants. And her team have that option too.

I’ve said this before: we are humans first and resources second.

And when we have a little more flexibility, it builds trust. It creates that safe space. And when people feel safe to contribute in that space. And they’re helping to co-create what that is. They feel like they’re part of something bigger. It helps to give our work more meaning. Those are the things that are important. More important than the money, believe it or not. But those are the things that are often lacking in our workplaces.

The second thing, is that just because Lena’s focus is on creating that space and freedom, doesn’t mean that she and her team don’t put in the work. They are incredibly disciplined. And as you heard, they have quite strict boundaries around how they use their technology. And when they use their technology. And also how they communicate with clients in an asynchronous way. This is all so that they can still deliver highly professional outputs, but in a way that supports their creativity, productivity, and wellbeing better, and their clients benefit from that ultimately, too

The last thing is the idea of perspective that Lena mentioned several times. How can you put your work into perspective in relation to what’s important in the rest of your life? Most of us are not performing open heart surgery. The world will generally not end if something goes wrong and we don’t make that deadline.

And also consider, do you enjoy what you do? Is it fulfilling? Are you having fun with your work? Or are you just slogging through one task as quickly as possible, so you can tick it off and start on the next? Because that desperation to reach the end destination is unsustainable. As Magdalena indicated, we’ve got to enjoy the ride.

So consider how you can bring more enjoyment into your work-life, whether that’s by reframing the un-fun things, to see the benefit they bring to your life. Or, by introducing more fun stuff into the way that you work.

Because life is too short and our work days are too long, not to have some fun.

I’ll be back soon, but a few things before you go.

You can find out more about my book at And helpful reviews are always welcome to help the book get found by those who need it.

If you liked the show, please share the love by rating it, where you listen to it. (Apple, Spotify, Google Play, or Amazon Music.)

And you can also support the making of Creating Cadence on Patreon or Buy Me A Coffee.

Until next time, keep moving forwards with courage, curiosity, and cadence. Bye for now.

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